Is it possible to change my Umbrel private key using a BIP-85 seed?

I recently created new seed phrases using BIP-85 generated from my coldcard.

Can I change the private key of my Umbrel using my own seed phrase while maintaining my blockchain download and apps?

Thanks for your time.

I don’t think the memomic for lnd (Aezeed) and your cold card (BIP-85) can be interchanged like you are hoping. They way that address are generated from the seed are different.

Also putting your coldcard seed onto another device, especially one that’s always connected to the internet, defeats the idea of using a hardware wallet.

BIP-85 generates unique seed phrases using the the entropy of your original seed phrase created by the coldcard. This has nothing to do with LND and the original coldcard seed is never used.

Ah, my mistake. I thought you were asking about importing your coldcard’s wallet into Umbrel.

If you want to use your own seed words instead of the one automatically generated for you, then start up a fresh install and I believe there is an option to “recover wallet” where you can enter in a seed. Though another warning, that choosing your own seed may not be as random & secure.

Also note that they still are different types of mnemonics and may not compatible.

To avoid redownloading the blockchain again, save the /umbrel/bitcoin/ folder and copy that back in after umbrel has finished setting up (details in faq).

Thanks for the information. I will wait for confirmation from an Umbrel team member about the recover wallet option as well as the compatibility. BIP-85 uses the BIP-39 wordlist to generate seeds so I’d imagine there is no reason that it would be any less secure or incompatible.

Fair enough, good luck.
They may also be able to point you to a way to go back to the setup process without reflashing, like deleting config/db/seed.

What did the Umbrel team member say? I am trying to do exactly what you’re doing and am also lost at the same step. I also read that there are different mnemonics… and have no idea how they do or do not work together. Would really appreciate an update!

Why would you do that?
Umbrel node is not meant to be used like that.
Umbrel node wallet is just a transitory onchain wallet, used to open/close LN channels. THAT’S IT.

You can connect any other onchain wallet app to it and use it’s RPC or electrum server for other wallets.
Umbrel node wallet IS NOT YOUR HODLING wallet! Umbrel is a hot wallet.
Here you have a guide about how to split your BTC stash into 3 parts: HODL, cache, SPEDNL and Umbrel have it’s unique position into that.

So I’m trying to do exactly the same thing that pseudotoshi is. The reason someone would want to use BIP85 functionality on the Cold Card to store the seed phrase associated with an Umbrel lightning node is because of major convenience and improved security (taken directly from the cold card):

“This feature derives “entropy” based mathematically on this (the coldcard’s main wallet seed) wallet’s seed value. This will be displayed as a 12 or 24 word seed phrase, or formatted in other ways to make it easy to import into other wallet systems. you can recreate this value later, based only on the seed-phrase or backup of this coldcard. There is no way to reverse the process, should the other wallet system be compromised, so the other wallet is effectively segregated from the cold card and yet still backed-up”

Ben@BTCsessions has some good videos on this.

So BIP85 functionality on the Coldcard is a very convenient way to store all your seed phrases from ALL your wallets in one place that is fully backed up by the cold card itself which is the gold standard for security. No one with 10 different wallets wants to have to worry about storing 10 different seed phrases on 10 different steel plates for example.

Unfortunately, in my experience, when I’ve tried to “recover” an Umbrel lightning node using a 24 word seed phrase generated by this BIP85 protocol, it does NOT work. Umbrel says: “unable to initialize wallet, wrong seed version.”

Well whadyaknow… somewhere I ran across AEZEED and LND and was like, what the heck is that?! A google search brought me to this:

So yeah… no way at all to use BIP85 to generate a BIP39 seed that will work with the Umbrel Lightning node if it’s using AEZEED, since that is incompatible with BIP39.